INFERNO – DAoC 2 is possible, here’s how

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On the Vault Mythic asks the dreamer to dream:

Okay, here’s the deal. The producers of Camelot (Walt and Jeff) wanted me to start this thread the other day, and I got bogged down in distractions. So do me a favor and make the most of it, and give the guys plenty to read today :)

What kind of expansion pack would make you excited? Wouldn’t be until next fall, and all the patches between now and then are probably going to be small improvements/fixes/revamp/tweaky things.

Land? Dungeons? Cities? Races? Classes? What about atmosphere, quests, items? What would be cool for you?

Again, leave this thread to the dreamers, everyone.

Despite the fact that the line saying “all the patches between now and then are probably going to be small improvements/fixes/revamp/tweaky things” doesn’t put DAoC’s future into a positive light, here are my ideas:

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Everyone playing the game would tell you that what would be interesting for the game would be about RvR and not PvE. Fortunately or not, DAoC was thought so that its RvR is designed more as a “virtual world” and that “satisfying repetable content” I quoted often in the last days. So the mudflation just doesn’t stick on it and thinking about an optional expansion for DAoC has always been rather hard since the premises of the game drag it in a completely different direction. In a similar way to what happens with Eve-Online (in fact CCP decided to not release pay-expansions but just work through the subscription fees and keeping to radically develop the game).

This is why the production of the game has always tried to find “tricks” to work on the RvR and still keep it free, like the “free expansion” concept that brought the whole “New Frontier” overhaul. Basically we have a problem. We need good ideas about features and content that can be added to the game but that would still be optional to a degree and not absolutely indispensable but at least desirable. The problem is that the idea of “content expansion” is appropriate for mudflated games but not to one where the real focus is the RvR and the competition between the players. You cannot offer the players buying the expansion a direct advantage over those that won’t. It would just break the game (the design between the past expansions always tried to maintain a delicate equilibre on the edge between desiderable -to encourage the players to buy the expansion- and optional content, sometimes going overboard like it happened with ToA).

One of the basic design principles that was behind ToA but that was also betrayed, is about the possibility to give some of the players access to tools that can then benefit everyone. Considering this premise and considering some humor about other problems, I’d say that whatever could be added in an expansion should NEVER be usable and useful for 8vs8. This to mark a line. If it was, we would just add to the game another brand new requirement that the players would just hate. So what would be left is the possibility for the RvR to develop something related to the keeps warfare or something related to larger RvR missions that could be triggered by someone with the access to the exp and then experienced together.

Another of my ideas could be also adapted to provide a viable and expansion-friendly further character development. While the possibility to raise the level cap (and creating enough content to justify an expansion) is just inconceivable for this game. It would just destroy it and force it for years to tweak and adapt everything to the new cap.

As you can figure out there isn’t much left. As I said, the game just isn’t suited to be expanded in this way. It needs a completely different plan. But this goes also beyond the scope of this article and I don’t want to go too radical and irrealistic. I will just have to find something viable, that doesn’t damage the game and that is still possible to package as an “optional” expansion.

The premises of my thoughs are described here above. These are the ideas I squeezed out:

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DAoC: INFERNO

+ Add in the exp pack a key-code usable only once. This key-code would allow a player to flag a character and instantly /level it to 45.

+ “The Evolution Server Project”. Transform the “evolution servers” idea into the exp pack (sort of a DAoC 2 built directly on DAoC). This would be a way to go heavy on the development and keep these servers as a separate project that can be accessed only to those buying the expansion. An occasion for Mythic to go back and solve radically the basic mistakes and offer to every player an occasion to start again (and, in the case they choose so, use the key-code to have a levelled up character and enjoy the endgame without really having to repeat the grind). I won’t go in the details about how the Evolution servers should be shaped up because it would go beyond the scope of these notes. But this is supposed to be the major content of the exp and not a superficial tweak to the rules.

+ (all servers) The possibility to use “formations” in RvR groups. These will be selectable by the group leader and will be triggered on/off just by /sticking to the group. Pressing a movement key would break the formation as it currently breaks the /stick.

+ (all servers) Follow and build on the Final Fantasy XI idea of adding NPCs henchmen. At level 20 the players will have the possibility to do a few duties for the realms (similar to the Chapters of DR, with missions based on the classic world) and receive a personal henchman (realistic or not) summonable only on PvE zones.

– These henchman will have their own classes based on the basic archetypes. All their skills and spells will be designed from zero and some can be “commanded” directly by the player (see below).

– An henchman gains experience and levels like the player. He acquires experience twice as fast compared to a normal player and his level cannot surpass the one of the player.

– An henchman can “respec” to different archetypes. Each respec can be executed freely but “burns” 20% of the current exp of the henchman for that level.

– The henchmen will have separate exp bars and levels for each archetype. So each archetype will need to be levelled separately or not at all if the player decides to specialize.

– This is also a chance to rework the AI of pets and the interface to make the controls more deep and interactive (like the possibility to “command” the execution of specific skills from the NPCs).

– The appearance of these henchmen can be customized, both in look and equipment. The henchmen can be equipped with the standard items used by the characters, special items and specific new items only usable by henchmen that will be linked to specific new quests.

– Each henchmen will be named by the player.

– Only two henchmen at max can join the same group.

(A note on the purpose of these henchmen: For a solo player, the possibility to have a bit more involving and interactive PvE and the possibility to level more efficiently, cutting down the downtimes some more. For the groups, the possibility to “fill” roles and classes missing from the group, for example to partially solve the problem of healers, or tanks, or whatever the group misses. The henchmen should never be more effective than a player playing the proper class and they should only count as a “half” player when calculating the group experience, so that the bonus should be inferior.)

+ Style redesign. This is an occasion for all the server types, included the Evolution servers to redesign the styles (both visually and the mechanics). The new style system would included simple “combo” skills that can be performed by coordinating some skills or spells with other players. These combos can also be used with henchmens (see the possibility to “command” the use of a skill). This change would affect players with or without the expansion.

+ Finally my favourite: Add INFERNO (all capitalized because it’s more badass). “Inferno” is a brand new zone, graphically similar to the “Veil Rift”, with chasms and floating platforms moving in circles around Lucifero’s dark castle. This would also allow to introduce a new technical feature: a physic engine (borrowing from Warhammer development). The physic will only be applied to the chasms and platforms. Basically these platforms can “bend” in a direction, randomly, because triggered or because of how the players are distributed (so that the platform will bend if all the players are in one spot instead of spreading around and distributing the weight). The players will have to fight both on these unstable platforms while facing the difficulties added by the physical engine, as well on more stable constructions.

– The physical model won’t factor the collision between the players and affects exclusively the inclination of the platforms. When a platform bends in a direction the players will have to move in the opposite direction in order to maintain the position and not fall off it. The different types of environmental happenings that the physical model includes will be: earthquakes (the player is shaken, making it lose the direction), dynamically opening chasms, and the inclination of the platform.

– If a player falls off a platform he will disintegrate. In this case he will reappear at the entrance of the zone at no loss after a short timeout (think to WoW’s graveyards).

– This zone has hard PvE content tailored for at least three full groups and divided into consequent segments. The players will start on a floating platform and will progressively move around controlling it (like a manual elevator or a flying carpet). With this moving platform they’ll access various points on the map where to fight a sequence of encounters and different mini-bosses to remove progressively the “locks” to the castle. Once the castle’s seals (graphically shown as huge chains attached to the castle) are broken (graphically shattering and falling down in the void), the players can storm in and eventually kill Lucifero in a final, epic battle.

– If a player dies or falls off a platform, he’ll be ported to the entrance as I already wrote. When there, he can have access to some sort of flying “taxi” that will bring him back to the main floating platform where the other players are. These taxis will be named “Charons” and should be shown graphically as gondolas driven by a masked dark figure. The Charons should speak through voice overs.

– Lucifero should be designed to be hard and as a very long fight.

– Once Lucifero is killed the zone will seal, porting out the players at the relic keep. The doors to the zone will remain closed at least for a week.

– The entrance to this zone will be placed in the center of Agramon.

– This zone is flagged for RvR, once open every realm can enter it, fight the enemy realms on these floating platforms (with the added fun of the physic model) and attempt to be the first to kill Lucifero.

These ideas would make DAoC stand out again among the competition and revindicate strongly its predominant role as an unparalleled RvR game for the years to come. The “Evolution server project” would be a way to appeal brand new players with the possibility to start in a brand new world refactored to eliminate all the radical flaws that plagued the game along these years. While the INFERNO would offer an innovating experience mixing brand new mechanics like the physic system of the platforms and chasms with the classic RvR wars for the ultimate RvR experience.

And let’s see if WoW can outperform that.

—
And to conclude I’ll also explain why the ideas I wrote here will never be implemented. Mythic is working on Warhammer, in a year it be in full production mode, while the playerbase of DAoC, in absence of significant changes and signs from Mythic, will be even more shrunk. Planning something daring won’t be considered as worth the effort by the guys at the decision-making positions.

What Mythic can still accept to “waste” on DAoC is the content team. A few artists, the quest team, a couple of new races or zones and so on. This is, sadly, what awaits DAoC, just a dumbed down, inexpressive support that is going to hand out to the players the yearly “sop”. A brand new weapon or piece of armor, a couple of minor skills. The actual “development intensive” roles, the production, designers and programmers will be busy working on the new game while DAoC will be left just to “train” a few new guys at a low risk, just to keep the game running and teach these trainees how the company works and offer them a chance to show their worth and get trapped like a “cog in the vast machine” that kills all the good ideas.

So I don’t expect much because along these years I get to know how Mythic thinks and reacts. Of course I would love to be surprised but I’d lie if I’d say that I think it could happen.

Again, leave this website to the dreamers, everyone.

After the War on Terror, the War on Pr0n!

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Oh my god, this is hilarious.

I thought it was a joke but it’s on the Washington Post:

The FBI is joining the Bush administration’s War on Porn. And it’s looking for a few good agents.

Early last month, the bureau’s Washington Field Office began recruiting for a new anti-obscenity squad. Attached to the job posting was a July 29 Electronic Communication from FBI headquarters to all 56 field offices, describing the initiative as “one of the top priorities” of Attorney General Alberto R. Gonzales and, by extension, of “the Director.” That would be FBI Director Robert S. Mueller III.

Hey! I thought the FBI was just about conspiracies and aliens, I didn’t know they even surfed the web searching for pr0n.

“Anti-obscenity squad”? Wow, that “The Filth” comics (btw, a masterpiece) written by Grant Morrison isn’t anymore completely off.

“The Department of Justice and the Federal Bureau of Investigation’s top priority remains fighting the war on terrorism,” said Justice Department press secretary Brian Roehrkasse. “However, it is not our sole priority. In fact, Congress has directed the department to focus on other priorities, such as obscenity.”

Obscenity? And who will watch the watchmen?

(comics, pr0n, computer games, rpgs, blogs. Do you need more geekdom today?)

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Mudflation as a mind-set

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A precisation about the mudflation and the rise of the level cap.

We used think about the mudflation when it comes to the content, itemization and economic systems but we forget that the mudflation goes beyond these boundaries. As I wrote in the other articles, the mudflation is a style of development that affects the whole game-world at its roots.

In particular I have a quote from Shane Dabiri (a producer of the game) which is reliable and adds one element that slipped out of my previous article: “We do not only give the existing spells a new level, we create new skills and talent-mechanisms”.

This is rather important because the mudflation will have an effect even on those new spells, skills and talent-mechanisms. The idea of having more tools and mechanics is an illusion. The mudflation, as explained, is a progressive erosion and loss of content. Not a growth.

The idea of adding depth and purpose to the game is exclusively a pretense and excuse. It’s a recursive, blind pattern coming right from the game mechanics to justify themselves and excuse the waste of more development time. It’s like if at the origin of a project there were deliberate flaws so that the product can be systematically replaced later on. This is the awful inheritance of the consumer society. We need to EXCUSE the production of new goods, so everything is created to be *already* flawed, disposable and temporary:

Jeff Freeman:
We’re more like Sports Illustrated.

The reason why game companies produce expansions for mmorpgs *is not* to expand and let the game-world evolve. It’s to PREVENT this. The mudflation is a way to CHOKE the potential and freeze the game in a recursive status where brand new excuses (like the rise of the level cap, or “better” versions of items) are produced to justify the new “fix” of content. We consume these worlds till there’s nothing left and need to move to something brand new to leech.

This could work for all the derivative goods that we consume daily. But it doesn’t work for a world. It is not appropriate and prevents the games in this genre to fulfill their true potential.

This is why I wrote down that silly idea about “MMORPG design with an ecological sensibility”:

Mudflated games finish to become just patchworks of more or less successful development. In 90% of the cases something broken or terribly unfun isn’t properly addressed and refactored. It just lies there as a “museum” while the developers work on something completely new in order to replace that part.

This is an approach that is strongly deep-rooted in a CULTURE. We produce JUNK. Nothing is reused because we throw everything away and buy something brand new. It’s the consumer society.

I do not like this because as in the real world this approach is killing the place where we live. It’s viable only as a temporary solution. We live on a countdown. We destroy the world because we have the illusion that everything can be replaced. There’s always space, always an exit. If something is broken or has problem, we do not fix it: we throw it away. We do not face the problems, we simply dodge them.

We bury them like we do with junk. We hide.

Going back to the idea of new talents, spells and skills. As I said, this doesn’t represent an exception to the mudflation. WoW is already *overwhelmed* by the insane amounts of buttons. While this made sense to offer classes that have more tools to use in the different situations, the principle has been stretched too much, chasing the superficial idea that: more is better. Whoever played some tactical games and understood how they work, knows that the depth of a system isn’t just because of the number of elements and rules involved. In fact the more you add them the more you move away from a tactical depth to drift toward something way more simple: the randomness. When there are too many rules and elements you obtain just a system that behaves at random and that noone can figure out. It would just be unfun and clunky.

If right now the buttons and bars take an 8% of the screen, I really hope that after 4-5 expansions I’ll still be able to see something beyond the UI. Good systems are kept simple. This is why the mudflation will have to take over this part as well. Some of the new skills and spells will *have to* replace old ones and become preferable (something similar already happens with the trinkets). An encounter cannot last for an hour so you can deploy all you have. At the end you’ll figure out an optimal pattern using around 8-10 buttons while the others will remain as rare, situational quirks.

This is why the fancy feature list on an expansion box claiming “more this and more that”, is just another empty excuse to justify the expense of more money while the designers remove content and open gaps that you *have to* fill if you don’t want to be outcast from this game-world.

Basically you are forced to join to comply and conform to this consumer sub-society with the greed for “more”.

Mkopec1:
And if they do this, will there be enough Lv70 type 5-15 man instances to appease the general public? and if they are in fact locking us out of the older Lv58-60 instances, are they gonna become ghost towns? Like 98% of EQ’s contentafter 5 years?

Tripamang:
Well they’re basically destroying what little content there is existing in the game, announcing it a year’ish in advance.. whats the point of even continuing if I come back 6-7’ish months form now, get the same gear in half the time and just plow through whatever new content there is at 70 for gear that’s might be worth keeping around that much longer =p

I guess what I’m getting at is that kills any sense of progression I’ve made so far.

Mkopec1:
This is what was concerning me also. If this is the case, why grind MC BWL and all that shit right now, when in a 1/2 years time all that shit will be obsolete anyways.

Algol Devilstar:
Why is this always brought up? Its called mudflation and it happens in every MMoRPG. Get used to it.

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A Path (to 70) Paved With Good Intentions

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While BlizzCon approaches to “reveal” and hype the news that I anticipated a week ago, for me it’s time to do what I actually find more interesting: commenting the new features and expressing my opinion about where the game is heading.

What I’d say is that I both expected and dreaded this rise of the level cap. If there’s something that shouldn’t happen to the game is to chase once again EverQuest’s tail and all its mistakes. The rise of the level cap included. At the same time, if I was leading the design of the game and if I was completely accountable about its progress, I think I’d put in the expansion this fancy feature: the level cap rised to 70.

The point is that the whole argument is way, way more complex and deep than how it appears. From a strictly functional and material (commercial) point of view the first merit of WoW is its accessibility that gave it the possibility to become a “mass market” product. It’s not a novelty if I say that WoW is great about everything but the endgame (this simple reference summarizes a fundamental point). If the players leave or don’t find the game anymore (or not enough) satisfying it’s because at some point you reach the level cap and have to deal with the horrible design that plagued the game from that point onward. Even if it’s true that they tried to cater and cover all kinds of players. Blizzard did a wonderful work to streamline and adjust the design of this genre to valorize the good parts and remove the bad habits, but they weren’t able to see past the curtain and even understand and address the real radical points that represent the mixed blessing of this genre (superficially: the “satisfying repetable content”, whether it is PvE or PvP).

The rise of the level cap is a quick “fix”, both in the sense of game-drug and as a functional and effective way to give back to the players that experience that they loved along the way and that faded when they hit the top, when they had to adapt their habits to the bigger raids and guilds. It works basically like the nostalgia. It’s like if you are warped back ten levels without even remembering to have gone through them and have to repeat the experience like if it was the first time. In this genre the possibility to refresh the sense of awe and achievement is definitely something precious and satisfying for the players. So: why not?

That’s the reason why if I was responsible about the game I would choose to go that way. Despite it conflicts with every other principle I have.

This premise is just to make clear that I criticize this half broken solution, but at the same time I expected it to happen and I also tend to justify it. What would actually matter now is about how it is implemented in order to minimize the problems. Because I believe that if you are aware of the risks, you can also decide to rise the level cap without breaking the game too much and actually offer something new and refreshing. How you use these tools is more important than the type of the tools you use. In this case I won’t go again in an endless dissertation about my design ideas about how this transition could be driven at best. Mostly because noone at Blizzard would read this and so it would be again just a wasted effort on my side and I prefer to dedicate myself to something else I find less frustrating.

Instead I think it’s interesting to point out the possible problems. Those “risks” I hinted. Between the various comments I read, I’d link Tobold’s comments, mostly because he writes clearly and always focusing on one-two arguments that can be then followed linearly instead of mixing and abstacting everything as I always do. His most interesting point beside the design difficulties to adapt the current content (talents, tradeskills, monster levels, PvP rewards etc..) is about the suggestion to stop to play right now and come back when the expansion is out. Which sounds crazy but is also true. While we can argue whether the current content will go or not right in the toilet, what is sure is that the current *progress* will.

We could assume that the players will retain their current gear for most of the hike to 70 but if this is true Blizzard would lose one of the strongest “fun” points: the sense of achievement. In the current game levelling is fun because you acquire new skills, spend talent points, get access to the mount and acquire progessively and constantly new gear. If the next 10 levels become just a grind with each level just giving out higher stats and nothing else, the “magic” would vanish easily and the expansion would finally feel rather dull. A game where you retain the same sword for 10 levels is a game that isn’t fun. So what could happen? Where is the line that will part the brand new level 60 character ready to move to 70 and those other players that have been at 60 for more than one year and collected all sort of powerful items? From my point of view the expansion will HAVE TO replace the gear for *all* the players. So, in a way or another, even the current purple gear will have to be mudflated and easily replaced. Not only through the new endless grinds awaiting us at 70. But also along the way, as accessible content even for the casual players. This is why Tobold is correct. Your current progress in the game is nihil if seen in perspective and prefectly fitting this following, explicatory, image (click on it to read a rather pertinent discussion):

When I say that this idea about raising the level cap is against all my principles it’s because it’s an argument that I discussed to exhaustion back then. It’s about the infamous mudflation. Quoting from three different articles:

“The mudflation is a way to continuously create, burn and replace.”

“The more the system is able to forget, the more the system is able to grow.”

“At the end the moral is that this cannot be an optimal process. There must be something better. The games modeled on a stain give only the illusion of content because the truth is that they are kept alive thanks to the mudflation. The truth is that the erosion, so the loss of content, is the reason why they still survive. This rings a bell? How it is possible that an old game can only survive through a loss of content when that content is supposed to be its main strength? How it’s possible that this loss underlines a quality (and probably the only one it has)?”

This last comment is particularly relevant because it brings the discussion on its real origin. We are back at considering the “satisfying repetable content”, or the lack thereof. If at the endgame we need to repeat an instance 50 times to get a drop it is not because the developers are sadistic. But because it’s the only way to keep up the pace and save time. I think everyone can agree without the need to follow a billion of explanatory links that the very first problem of WoW at the endgame has been about the “lack of content”. This has been the main topic since launch and it’s a general problem that is shared between ALL mmorpgs. Every developer working in this genre knows that the first issue is to find a viable solution to produce acceptable content at a decent pace. The debate between handcrafted and randomly generated content is still alive and well (think to the brand new discussion about Will Wright’s “Spore” and the use of algorithmic models, textures, worlds), exactly to try to deal with this need to optimize and maximize the production of content.

In this genre this is one of the main issues and probably the only one to which both the players and developers agree. Now, if this is something so absolutely fundamental, why the hell we design games that mudflate, hence erase progressively the content? Isn’t this totally absurd, inacceptable and counterproductive when the very first problem is to produce that content that now is meant to be replaced? How can this be logical and acceptable?

This brings the discussion back to the idea of mmorpgs like “disposable goods”, something that I strongly criticize and feel like the antithesis of the nature and strength of this genre. Not only this type of design is nowhere efficient and optimal commercially (since it demands a pace of content production that isn’t realistically possible and surely not convenient), but it also breaks what this genre has to offer. And instead of actually dealing with this problem, the decision to rise the level cap is mostly a way to “buy time” and postpone.

Blizzard has spent almost a year (and by the time the expansion is out, a year and half) trying to cope with the request for more endgame content. And with just one nimble gesture they are going to dismiss all that work to warp back in time (this is the true nature of the mudflation) and restart from zero to add to the game brand new content aimed to the new level cap and the following super-slow grind to progress on the gear acquisition. This is a silly excuse to waste development time, not a proper answer to the problem and a way to let the game develop in a positive way in the long term. As I wrote in my comments on the mudflation, this type of development will just deteriorate the game over time and its negative effects will be evident only later, when it’s not anymore possible to plan everything in another way.

Adding the comment I wrote on Corpnews for a more concrete and direct summary:

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A whole lot of content will go right in the toilet.

The point is that a more or less trivial quest at 70 could hand out a “blue” that would just be more or less the same, if not better, than the “purple” at level 60.

Why the hell would you want to organize raids and farm 100 times those fucking old instances when you can get better rewards from the new content?

You are forgetting that it isn’t enough to go there and finish the instance to get your loot. You need to go there 50-100 times to get your stuff.

And why the hell a player would want to endure that fucking boring grind when there will be brand new shiny content at *all levels of difficulty*?

You assume that level 70 instances will be super hard (btw, “hard” was doing Blackfathom and Gnomeragon at the proper levels, not that dull raid content dissimulated by lag and choreography). But if Blizzard repeats their design and principles at 70 you’d have instances that need super catass equimpent as well as the brand new 5-man we had at 60s made now 70.

Without even considering that the whole lore goes to hell when you kill daily Ragnaros and all the rest. The feeling of a cohesive, immersive and consistent world just goes to hell. It’s violated.

This type of design has its head stuck in its ass. We complain about the lack of ideas, but the problem is that it’s all dark in there.

—
To conclude, a “dialogue” taken right from the official forums:

Foozle #1:
If the level cap is to be raised, what happens to the people who choose not to buy the expansion? Will everyone be able to level up to the new cap or only the people who buy the expansion?

Foozle #2:
you will have to get the expansion, unless you wanna sit in the world by yourself…

Foozle #3:
stfu and buy it you cheap ninja

(continued)

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A proof of sense

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There’s a thread on Q23 discussing the possibility of Valve working on a mmorpg based on the world of Half-Life. Now what interests me isn’t directly that discussion but a comment that stusser wrote:

stusser:
Besides, valve is going in the exact opposite way. Half-life2 isn’t about immersing the player in the world. It’s about immersing the player in the narrative. That’s why they put so much work into facial gestures and movement, to aid the suspension of disbelief. It’s the kind of technology suited to handcrafted lovingly designed content meant to experienced at a discrete moment for maximum penetration, which certainly doesn’t describe a PSW.

My comment:

“In fact HL2 would be PvE.”

If you think about it and revert the perspective you could see what I mean. Instead of thinking whether Half-Life would be appropriate for a mmorpg or not, think from the perspective of the mmorpgs and the flaws or weaknesses of the PvE. Now go back to reread what susser wrote. Isn’t what he describes exactly what the PvE misses at this moment?

I think so.

This ties back with many things I wrote, my ideal separation between PvP and PvE (some references here and here) and all the other discussions about the instancing.

Another spin to the wheel

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It started as a “quick” reply on this thread to finish to include many notes and abservations that I was waiting to organize. This came out even too easily. I rarely can write this clearly and straight to the point. It doesn’t happen always that I can write without struggling with myself and what I want to say.

The main topic is the PvE in DAoC and the newbie experience. But it then joins a bunch of different topics that I’m discussing these days and that are all related.

I’m going to post this on F13 in a few hours, if you want to stop me, do it now :)

—

Doing the Champion quests should get you enough CL experience to reach CL3, assuming you do nothing else. As for the rest, I’d argue that unlike TOA, you absolutely do not need CL5 to be RvR-ready. It’s like the titles at RR11+, something nice as a reward once you get there, not something to “grind” to.

1- This ruins the content. At least assuming that for “champion quests” you mean the three chapters. Retaining these to do them at 50 to maximize the gain (since you can start to acquire the exp only at 50) makes the content even more dull than how it is already since the first chapter is tailored for level 30 and the second for level 40. Fighting a bunch of greys to accomplish very simple and linear tasks won’t be all that entertaining.

2- It’s not that the CLs are required for RvR, it’s just that in this case the reward isn’t really appropriate to the time required. In other words: not justified.

Now the points is: why was it changed (nerfed) at the end of the beta? From the comments, true or not, I heard that you received around a .4 for killing an enemy in solo. Which would still be an acceptable balance considering you would have the bar moving and the ten bubbles filling up at a decent pace. There are already the Realm Ranks to define that type of slow and exponential progress, there’s no reason to add another overlapping.

Since the Cs don’t really stack in power (the same assumption that was betrayed with ToA) their purpose is to broaden the class. Offer it some more minor tricks. This has the sole scope of making them more fun to play since one of the limits of the game is about having classes that are too strict and specialized. Hence it’s another of those parts of the game that you WANT to valorize, instead of keeping it away from the players.

The titles in RvR and the Ranks can be “achievement based”. Because that’s their direct and natural purpose and sense. But it’s not so good to retain the achievement based mechanic for the CLs. There’s nothing to achieve because they don’t offer anything that is worth pursuing. Instead they add some FUN to the classes that would be a good idea to hand out to the players for “cheap”. Like it already happens for the weapons.

What I mean is that there isn’t really a good reason to make it slow instead of more quick. You are just pushing back the fun.

And this goes further because it’s a patter Mythic is repeating. In September you nerfed the exp in the TDs. Why? Again there isn’t a good reason to do this and it just damaged the game some more.

Let’s put it in this way: our life is too short to waste time grinding repetitive and dull PvE content that doesn’t offer any challenge. That’s what the TDs are. So why a designer would want the players to spend MORE time there? Where is the gain? Where is the purpose? This problem is really at the basic level. In a game you can offer a grind only for those parts that are already representing a satisfying repetable content.

The RvR in DAoC is a great and perfect example of “satisfying repetable content”. The PvE is NOT.

This is why noone criticizes the Realm Ranks *grind* and why there are players that always praise it above what WoW implemented. The grind here is appropriate. It doesn’t ruin the game. It valorizes it. But it’s completely different when you reapply grindy mechanics to the PvE (both as exp grind and money grind). ALL KINDS OF GRINDS aren’t fun in a dull, repetitive PvE. And there isn’t a single decent reason why you would find acceptable and useful to TRAP the players in a cavern for days. It follows the same unjustified and unfun design trend that we have criticized for all these years. It’s masochistic.

Players complain because this is logically wrong.

So, again, why the exp in the TDs was nerfed? The only reason I can imagine is to rebalance the experience gained there in relation with the rest of the game. In fact there’s that “triad” that I already commented and that is the reason why I was against AlteredOne proposed changes:
1) In TDs you quickly gain money and exp / but not loot
2) In the instanced dungeons you can “quickly” gain Aurulite, hence items / but the exp is crap
3) The quick task quests around the non-instanced zones give you easier *soloable* and short tasks that give you medium money and exp

Schematizing:
1) ++money ++exp –loot
2) –money –exp ++loot
3) +exp +money ++easy to solo

The first patter was by far the most efficient. In fact with the money you can also go buy equipment and even aurulite. This is why the only reason I found to the nerf to the exp in TDs is about rebalancing those patterns. But this doesn’t justify it. We still lack the satisfying repetable content and these patterns were rebalanced in the WRONG direction. It was the other two patterns that needed to be brought in line with the TDs and not the other way around.

But there’s even another point to consider. Why the hell we would need three different patterns? The PvE is the same in all three. It doesn’t offer anything different:

You have so many different possibilities just with Catacombs. You can level by taking these solo mini-quests in the new zones, you can farm aurulite in the new instances or the instances of the classic dungeons, or you can do task dungeons to farm directly the experience at an insane rate. But, no matter what you choose, the experience (of the player) is completely MISSING. You can trade between voids. Between empty experiences that are there just as excuses (and excusing what exactly?).

This is why I believe that DAoC would need a *consolidation* of its PvE and not a further fragmentation as it happened. Of course, it would benefit from a fragmentation of the PvE intended as: different types of challenge and patterns presented. Different qualities and something that could be actually involving. But what DAoC diversificates is not the actual PvE (which is dull and repetitive in every case) but the rewards. The reward is the only difference setting apart the three patterns. And it is obvious how this isn’t positive for a game that definitely doesn’t need a grind applied to this type of content, in particular when the fragmentation of the PvE is furtherly made worse by the population problems and the isolation of the players through the instanced content.

We already know that instancing has both good and bad consequences. This is even worse in a game with population problems (in particular at the lower levels, where the newbies need reasons to have fun and get involved) and with this fragmentation of the PvE that has no good effects or logical justifications.

This is why it’s always not so trivial to analyze all these parts and why it’s not possible to just claim a bonus to the exp or something similar. All these things delve deeper. Why the hell we cannot have a place where we can get good money, good exp and even good equipment? What are the valid reasons that brought to the fragmentation of patterns I illustrated above? I don’t know any. What I know is that the great majority of the players are grinding the TDs DEFINITELY NOT because they are having fun. But just because they are the most efficient pattern offered. They don’t enjoy the content. They ENDURE it. And this isn’t acceptable in an environment where you are supposed to have… fun. An environment that is supposed to valorize its qualities and not its problems.

Now I hope my point is clear: the existence of the TDs in the game is completely unjustified. So it makes sense to remove them since they damage the game. Now think to what could happen if Mythic would announce the removal of the TDs. The players would RAGE. And here’s another important point. The players wouldn’t be angry because you remove something fun from the game, but because you remove a viable, consolidated and optimal pattern that they *absolutely need*. It’s their pattern of choice. The “fun” and the optimized pattern must be kept separate. They aren’t the same entity. The players are merely choosing the “less worst” pattern they have available to endure the PvE treadmill and reach the endgame, that, contrarily to WoW, is that part of the game that still justifies a subscription fee. How could we “valorize” the PvE instead of balancing the “less worst” patterns as it happened till now?

Imho the TDs must be completely eradicated. That’s the very first step. They never made sense both from the player’s perspective and the design. They are unjustified and just damage the game. They only “dissimulate” a value by offering the best pattern available. But that value is solely functional and totally inappropriate.

The second step, also following the line of thoughts above, is about moving the “TDs mechanics” (go to taskmaster and take the two-types missions, the “clear dungeon” should be just removed) WITHIN the Instanced Dungeons where you farm aurulite. Because there isn’t a valid reason to keep the “reward” patterns separate. There are no advantages. This would instead encourage the players to focus on something more varied. The IDs offer a more refreshing experience than the TDs and they are naturally suitable to inherit their role. We remove the TDs and carry over their functional role to the IDs where the players would benefit from a more rewarding and complete experience:

a) Players will hunt everything they need: money, exp and equipment. Also helping them to be “viable” for the RvR BattleGrounds.
b) The experience will be more varied and refreshing: the IDs offer more varied environments and challenges.
c) This would consolidate the “game space”, encouraging the players to gather and group.

While ToA exhibited a blatantly flawed design under everyone’s eyes, Catacombs still brought new mistakes that are also damaging the game, just in a more subtle and less apparent way. Which doesn’t make those mistakes any less significant.

I think that what I wrote here is a demonstration of why we cannot compile a personal wish list and expect to do something positive to the game. Things are complex and need an involved discussion where the arguments can be delved and explained. This isn’t a conclusion even if I provided my own. This is instead a possible start to confront those ideas, contribute to shape new ones and avoid to repeat the past mistakes.

Down in Flames

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Things seem to return cyclically.

Exactly one year ago I went in a research to read more about the drama I completely missed. Those three posts I archived were what I considered “significant”. In fact one of the purposes of this website is to preserve a “memory”, to retain something from the past so that the discussions can have a sense and don’t have to be repeated over and over like some kind of ritual that doesn’t bring anywhere. It’s in fact when you have an history that you can look forward and expect something new and different.

But, besides this digression, there’s this topic that keeps coming up. The reason why I wrote about it a year ago was because a totally random article on Lum’s blog degenerated in a flame and was finally completely removed. Of course this tickled my curiosity and, as it always happens, reading old articles and forums threads is even more interesting today than it was at that time. For me it’s indispensable to know what came before me, even more so because I arrived too late, when everything was already crumbling. Basically I missed the best and now I feel the need to understand what happened because I think it’s important for me. It’s that piece of “history” that I miss.

It’s not that I don’t have already my point of view and what I’m going to read won’t probably change my ideas. But it helps me to put things into perspective and it’s always funny to go back and reread what I wrote at that time (here and, in particular here). Beside a few obscure points that I cannot understand anymore (I really don’t have a clue about what I meant about the two conflicts of interest) all the rest is still rather coherent with what I think today. The comments I wrote on Lum’s (new) revival and that I’ll archive here below will confirm this.

There are also some funny coincidences that correspond with this whole cyclic thing. In fact just a couple of weeks ago Coke reappeared on this same site and I even got an half-flamed e-mail from D One for reasons I didn’t really understand. All this happened before the revival started and it still made me check their forum because I remember that one year ago I registered there for the purpose to convince them to write again. I couldn’t find those threads (there were some discussions around October 04 that are now gone and replaced by some brand new silly flames) but I stumbled on the same rant (on page 5) that was then pasted in the recent revival. As time passes I find more and more unjustified their hatred against Lum, but, still, I’d like to hear again their point of view on things. Because, even if I can have a completely different opinion, I think that more voices are always good for the community. This is why I’m always happy when new blogs appear (without the blogs and the forums I would have nothing to say) and why not so much when the community splits.

And, to conclude the cycle, thisisnotacommunity.org is back, sort of. Even if D One reminds me the prophecy from Glitchless: “As sure as the sun will rise…”

With the new revival (also discussed here, while on F13 are busy on more interesting and serious topics) I discovered brand new sources that help to see what went on under different points of view. There’s a recap written by Musashi (the pictures offer more insight and are more interesting than what he wrote) which seems the “authorized version” and the one that should take Lum’s defence and another, still mild, on answers.com that originated the rant and the following revival.

Following here the comments I wrote on BrokenToys and that explain my own “distorted” point of view. The conclusion is brand new and also poking some fun at Sanya who accused me.

—

When people fondly remember (or curse) LtM, most seem to forget that while we had zero problem pointing out that the Emperor was butt-arsed naked, we also noted when things were done RIGHT.

This is exactly what I think as well.

As I wrote on Corpnews it’s *undeniable* that LtM had a strong weight on the success of DAoC in the same way it used to make the difference and become a precious playground that will remain unparalleled just *forever*.

Mythic leeched LtM and they capitalized on it. They used positively the comments to build and adjust their game. And if the game, nowadays, is still good, I believe, it’s thanks to that sort of mindstorming process and chaotic creativity that was LtM back then. It was a laboratory on its own and Mythic took everything from it. The creativity, the vitality and the hype.

There were huge conflicts of interest, but everywhere, not just about Lum. And were those conflict of interest to make things different and make them *matter*. It was an open laboratory where everyone contributed in his own way.

Today all that is lost and not anymore recoverable. The shared passion for the genre is gone. The player base has been dumbed down and “educated”. Now we just squeal from screenshots. That’s how I get 600 visitors on the site at once. The direct involvement is gone forever, the game companies have chosen to detach themselves from their community because they felt threatened when that contact was instead what made them move in the first place.

Now it’s all muffled down, deliberately. And all those coincidences that brought to the LtM phenomenon won’t probably happen again.

—
My point is: I’ve read a whole lot about what happened back then. That rant site, Musashi’s version, the “answers” page, forums threads, Coke’s posts and so on.

I’ve yet to see all of them disagreeing on something concrete. I didn’t really find divergent versions.

What I saw, instead, is just the same meltdown seen through a lens. Some parts are made bigger, some parts smaller till the point they are omitted. But it all comes down to opinions and how people perceived all that happened in their particular way.

If Musashi’s version is the “authorized” version, I didn’t really find any huge differences to what was written in that silly rant page that originated this thread. Just a different (and partial) point of view. As are different (and distorted) the comments I wrote here above.

Again I should repeat that I NEVER heard of LtM and DAoC before they melted *together* as an unique topic. Here in Italy people started to talk DAoC ALONG with LtM. They talked DAoC BECAUSE of LtM. I believe that what made the site great is what killed it. The community. It’s about that idea of the laboratory I explained above and that saw everyone in a open confrontation. And this (my) perspective is completely different from Musashi’s one because he says that it’s instead the community that ruined the site and that all he wanted to read was Lum and exclusively for his own special and absolutely irreplaceable (this is why, despite the number of website has gone up, we have NOTHING that is even vaguely near to what LtM was) talents: “Lum was a funny writer, insightful, vitriolic, literate, and interesting to read”.

Lum’s talent is unquestionable and he worked as a catalyzer that built something that went overboard. Of course Lum didn’t like this and people who were on Lum’s side also didn’t like it. But from *my own* personal perspective and opinion what happened at the end, the vibrant community that existed for a brief moment before things started to wreck, is the most important point that *made the difference*, and the reason why we STILL talk about it. Both inside and outside this niche community.

What happened back then had an impact beyond Lum and beyond the boundaries of the happenings of a group of passionate players. This is why I use to quote GBob and his line on what LtM was: “Lum the Mad was riding high with his web site, forcing game companies to engage the player base in a real dialog.”

See? It started because Lum’s writing skills and talent (and passion). But it’s where it brought to matter today. Because Lum’s writing skills (and the mock-up things, Katrina’s stuff is another perfect example) still exist, no matter what he writes about. He is publishing a book, in fact. But what we care about is still the little inner world of the mmorpgs and the impact that LtM had back then and that we still feel strong today.

And that Lum definitely didn’t achieve by himself.

—
My conclusion should be already rather clear. LtM created a controversy. And this controversy fueled DAoC in both a good and bad way. In a moment where both were absolutely needed to keep the game at the center of the attention. This is why Mythic “used up” the community and leeched it till nothing was left. And this is also why not only I believe that they did something legitimate, but also something that I would still like to see today. Because, as I wrote at times, it’s the conflict of interest that makes things matter and become interesting. Without that commitment we just finish to become politically correct and lose track of what actually matters (I agree with the rant site on this point).

This is why I would like the developers discuss THEIR OWN GAME and not some other generic topic and this is why what matters is the actual confrontation and not a “wish list” where everyone posts his own idea completely isolated from the rest and directly avoiding the actual discussion about what is going on. We discuss to agree, disagree and form opinions.

Everything is good but what we really miss is the synthesis. We are right now too fragmented and isolated. Everyone speaks about his own thing on his own blog or forum post. But there isn’t anymore a synthesis and an actual confrontation that can matter and shape what will happen next.

This is my distorted point of view. This is why I think that what is holding Mythic is the indifference. This is also why I don’t really like how things are shaping up. And, finally, this is the reason why my site doesn’t replace my presence on the forums, from the niche communities to the “cesspits” (WoW’s general boards, the Vault, FoH etc..).

What is sure is that I’ll never try or even think to emulate what Lum did. Simply because I lack the charisma and because my voice is just my own and not other people’s voice. I don’t like to pretend to be someone I am not.

It’s like if you have to run all you run all your life to demonstrate everyone you are not who you are. Even if you intimately know how false it is.

People change and yet they remain the same. I believe that you obtain the best result when you don’t fight with yourself to be something else you’ll never be. In fact I liked that entry on the Herald.

Btw, now that I know that “LoH” is Lum’s wife, I wonder if she wouldn’t make a better ranter than himself.. ;)

And a last quote that will allow me to add one note I wrote down and that I forgot to merge with what I wrote above:

Mox:
Whenever I think “Things were much better X years ago” I immediately think “That’s what my father would say. Am I him yet?”

Now it’s all lost and we have to cry? No because what was written at the time is still precious. This is why we have blogs. To build upon things. To remember, to think. To not just let things glide by.

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Just because I wasn’t done

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For the recap I’ll send you here.

I was finally able to read even the first part of the preview, so here’s a few more details that were missing from my other reports:

– The whole expansion will be centered around the Outlands, Medivh and the Dark Portal to make the main storyline progress.

– Background: Sargeras, the Titan representing the “evil” in the game, still wants to destroy the universe. His last plan is to ignore Azeroth, where he ecountered an unexpected resistence, to focus on the Outland. The realm with the remains of the planet of Dreanor, homeland of the orcs. What is left of this place grants access to the Twisting Nether, a portal that can be used to access every other plane of the existence. Here is where the battle between the forces of Azeroth and the demonic forces of Sargeras and his two lieutenants, Archimonde and Kil’Jaeden, will take place.

– The orcs were brought on Azeroth by Medivh through the Dark Portal. Still through the same portal the humans invaded Dreanor and damaged the portal, producing devastations on both sides. Destroying Dreanor from one and creating the Blasted Lands from the other.

– Through the Caverns of Time (located in Tanaris) the players will be able to see the zone surrounding the portal before the disaster and, in particular reenact the invasion of the orcs through the portal. The Caverns of Time are the place where the bronze dragons lead by Nordozmu “supervise” the flow of time.

– The Caverns of Time will allow the players to reenact three events. The invasion of the orcs as written above, the release of Thrall from enslavement and the battle of Mount Hyal, where the humans, orc and elves defeated Arthas and his army.

– The Deadwind Pass zone should get a restyle with the new year to be ready for the release of the expansion and the Kharazan instance.

– At least these two big instances are confirmed. Kharazan and the Caverns of Time.

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